Join Principal Architect Jim Brisnehan and Interior Designer Amanda Kreutzer as they take you inside the design process of the brand-new, modern office facility for Diamond Plastics. Discover the key considerations that shaped this impressive workspace, from creating a secure and welcoming entry for international visitors to fostering internal collaboration through open work areas and a vibrant break room. Learn how strategic architectural and interior design choices, including a focus on employee well-being and subtle brand integration, created a functional, professional, and culturally resonant environment that reflects Diamond Plastics' global presence and team-oriented ethos.
(Skyler): Welcome, everybody, to another episode of the Laying the Foundation podcast. My name is Skyler. I'm your host today. And joining me for a very special episode, we have Jim Brisnehan from our Grand Island office, as well as Amanda Kreutzer, also from Grand Island. And the two of you were involved with a project for designing an office building for Diamond Plastics. So today we’ll be using that as an example to talk about designing a modern office building. Now, this is a pretty recent project. Has it actually opened? Is it in function currently, or are they still finishing?
(Jim): We are still in construction.
(Skyler): Okay, okay. So they're still putting the finishing touches on it. But talking with you guys previously about this, there were some really cool amenities, there was some specific direction that in the design of the facility, which you guys had taken to sort of create a very modern office. Some things with some key features that aren't, you know, the classic old offices that we see from the past, that are just white walls and cubicles and all that other stuff. Stuff that's not conducive to work, and a healthy workplace, you might say. So, to kick things off, if you guys could give me a kind of rundown of Diamond Plastics. Obviously, they approached us for the design of this facility. First of all, who are they and what do they do to give us kind of an idea of what they were looking for with their office?
(Jim): Diamond Plastics is one of, if not the largest, maker of plastic pipe, utility pipe in the world. Not just in the nation, but in the world. They currently make the largest diameter plastic pipe of any of the manufacturers, which is five feet across.
(Skyler): Oh, wow. That's almost my height. It's a little bit less, but yeah, that'd be like if I could just lie down in this pipe.
(Jim): Yeah, you see it going down the street on the back of a trailer, and there's only one pipe on the trailer. That's how massive it is. They've been around since 1980. They are a company that started right here in Grand Island, Nebraska, and they've now got locations all over the United States, Europe, and South America.
(Skyler): Oh, wow. So yeah, international company.
(Jim): They are international. They are internationally owned as well. So there were a lot of differences and nuances that we had to go through while working with this client. It is a client that I actually worked for this company when I was in college.
(Skyler): Oh, ok.
(Jim): So they knew me. My dad worked for this company for 40 years. He was the financial person, so he never wanted to spend money. His whole thing was You think it's going to make you money? So invest in pipe, and all that, and don't worry about where we are. So before this, they were just in a small corner of the plant for their main offices and everything that encompasses what they do. And their president never felt like that was what they should be. And especially as they've grown in prominence and now, like I said, one of, if not THE world's largest plastic pipe makers, he's like, we need a corporate office that's going to show as such.
(Jim): And their backers felt the same way. And we embarked on this journey to come up with an office that was very different than what you would see around here as well. They’re, again, it kind of comes back to the whole international side of things.
(Skyler): Right.
(Jim): There were some flares and some things that they wanted that were just different and more amenities than what a normal office building would have.
(Skyler): Sure, absolutely. I think that jumps us right into the next question. Obviously, we were approached by it. I'm guessing probably due to the close connections that you had and have had in the past. And so I'm guessing that's how that kind of came about. And then when they did approach us about this project, I mean, what was the full scope, what was the full plan that they were hoping to go for?
(Jim): They pretty much got the full plan. They didn't spare any expense on things that they wanted. They wanted something that was going to speak to the brand for which they were, they wanted something that was going to be modern and not just a roll of offices stuck in a corner.
(Skyler): Right.
(Jim): And that really brought all of their sides together. So the salespeople and the staff people and the corporate folks are now in a large space together so that they can communicate with each other as well as then a place to have larger conferences, bring employees in to have different meetings and trainings, and all of that type of stuff.
(Skyler): Sure. So they had a lot of needs that they were hoping to meet. So obviously they wanted to be able to bring people together, like you just said. And then there were things within that, right? They had plans for a training area, they had plans for a conference area, and things along those lines, so that they could increase productivity, they could increase collaboration, communication, things along those lines.
(Jim): Correct. And then with this being a hub and being in storm country. We do have a storm tornado shelter in this facility. There's redundancy in backup for all the data because it is the hub that goes out to all the different manufacturing plants. So it's a very important center for this corporation.
(Skyler): Absolutely. They're hosting some server kind of stuff, essentially. Okay, very cool. Okay, so we've talked about what Diamond Plastics is, who they are, and what they needed for this project, at least a little bit. And then jumping into the design that came out of what they've pitched to us at this point. One thing you guys had mentioned was a nice reception area that was a little bit different than the typical reception area you might see at any given company. What made their reception area different, and why did they want it that way?
(Amanda): Their reception desk is a little bit different. We showed initial options where it was your typical, when you first walk in out of the vestibule, you have that reception person there. They're the ones who are greeting you initially. However, as we've kind of learned, especially with COVID, that position isn't always as functional as it used to be. That person is doing a lot more jobs. Especially here in our office. We used to have a person. Unfortunately, she passed away, and we've never been able to fulfill that position again. So our desk sits empty. Well, they explained to us that their person, I believe her name is Katie, I can't quite remember, but she does a lot of different tasks. So she's not always at her desk. And they did not want to have a desk sitting empty when you first walked in.
(Skyler): That makes sense.
(Amanda): So we kind of made a secondary vestibule. What we landed on, going through different options, was the idea of walking past the main vestibule into a secondary vestibule that's very nice. It's a focal piece. We have a nice big chandelier that's going to be really fun and unique, but letting that space have some visibility to the actual reception area, which is outside of that space, where she is sitting. But that way, usually when people come into the space, they know who they're meeting with. The people who are going to be greeting them will come out, unlock the door, they can come in. That, or they can knock on the window to that desk and flag her down and say, “Hey, I need in.” And then she can help them.
(Skyler): Sure.
(Amanda): A little bit different approach than what we typically do with reception desks, but again, making it still that big focal entrance. So when you walk in, it's not just a little white box that you're standing in.
(Skyler): Yeah, absolutely.
(Jim): It still has security, it has a phone, it's got a camera and microphone, back to the desks and to a couple of different locations so that somebody knows that they're there, somebody can let them in. But it is a step above. I mean, there's a fireplace, there's a story wall for the company, and everything else. It kind of brings a little bit of life.
(Amanda): Yeah, absolutely. They wanted to take from their existing space and pictures of their plants. So we have a wall where they can do that. Some shelving so that they can put their awards and whatever else up. A spot for a TV so that they can do a slideshow of various things to highlight. But just really making that again, that focal piece.
(Skyler): No, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, that's why we're here, right? To talk about designing a modern office building. And that's one of the things. You're not a retail business where just anyone can walk in and buy stuff. This is very client-oriented. So, anyone that's going to be showing up at your office, somebody's been in communication with. And it does kind of feel a little pointless to have a person whose sole job is to kind of sit at the front and sort of greet people and then lead them into whoever it is that they're here to talk to. Usually, salesmen or what have you, they know this person's on their way, I'm going to come and meet them in the front. Or, you know, like you said, you'll have somebody who is there to kind of help people along when necessary. And oftentimes I think that the reception areas will kind of block the view of the rest of the office, too. Usually, it's a big wall or a big desk with a backing to it or something like that. And that really kind of hides everybody else away. Which may not be the most ideal thing when a client walks in the door. They want to be able to experience this nice area, but they also want to know that they're being noticed or know that things are going on. So I think that's a really cool example of things change and we adapt with it versus we just do this because it's the way it's always been done. What about the offices themselves? What kind of design did we go for as far as where the employees were working? How was it either similar to or different than what you might typically see in an office setting?
(Jim): I'm going to say it's a little more typical of what you would see for a larger organization. A lot of natural light.
(Skyler): Oh, good.
(Jim): Most of the offices have glass fronts, so there's visibility between them and the people who work just outside of the office in their departments. So everybody can see everyone else. If the salesman can see right down and look and see that the president of the office of the corporation is sitting in his office, and vice versa. They can see clearly back; there are window walls back into the IT area, so you can see what's happening there. It's just a very open feel to the office, and they picked some furniture that would really complement that.
(Amanda): Yeah, I would say that in the offices, they're not totally atypical, they're pretty traditional, but in the sense that we really wanted them to be open and team-oriented. But some of the things that we discussed when we were initially going through the visioning session of this were what they wanted that overall feel to be. Some words that came from that were definitely “diamond.” They had a whole spiel about what that meant for them, which I will not even try to reiterate because I will butcher it so badly. They did such a good job of it. But other things were “professional,” “sleek,” “comfortable,” “relaxed,” and “warm contrast.” I think that we tried to achieve those in the finishes as much as we could, but just in general, making sure that it felt like an office, but a fun dynamic...
(Skyler): Right.
(Amanda): …new office compared to what they have now, especially because what they have now is not anything spectacular by any means. So we wanted to give them that space that they really wanted to come to every day, that felt professional and vibrant.
(Skyler): Now it is a bit of a challenge to juggle… I mean, a lot of people might think the terms “professional” and “comfortable,” or “relaxed,” are on two ends of the spectrum. Is that necessarily the case, or is there… I mean, obviously we found a way to kind of combine them to some extent.
(Amanda): Yeah, I feel like in our offices here at CMBA, we do a really spectacular job of that because we're allowing that open office, professional atmosphere where we can do team building things. But it's still comfortable. I think the furniture piece for Diamond Plastics is going to be crucial for the fact that they are an office working together to pick the exact furniture for what they want. They're not doing one size fits all, and that's something that here at CMBA we’ve done. When I started, all the chairs were the same. Eventually, I started having back pain and had to go to a physical therapist. I convinced them to buy me a new chair, and I have not had issues since. It's been awesome.
(Skyler): We're in these chairs for eight, nine hours a day. We’ve got to have the right one. And not everybody's person is the same, right?
(Amanda): Exactly. And I think that's when it comes down to what you envision as comfortable in an office atmosphere? It's those little things. It comes down to making it be professional, yet comfortable. So the desk fits you, right? The chair fits you, right?
(Skyler): Absolutely.
(Jim): We were working with the furniture designers as we were working through the project itself. It was important that they both spoke to one another.
(Skyler): Absolutely. Those are details that you want to have in place before we get to that part of the design process, or I guess, most of the construction is done. Right? We don't want to decide that at that time. We want to have that decided beforehand, for sure.
(Amanda): And I think too, with the “comfortable,” there's another aspect of that where you're talking about amenities, and Jim mentioned this earlier, but bringing in those other little things. We have a large break room, but we have a secondary break room that's actually closer to the desks, and into the offices, and making sure that they have access to the things they need.
(Skyler): Absolutely. And it's almost reinforced, right? The comfortable and relaxed environment reinforces the professional. Because we're professional to the level where we are working so hard to make sure that our clients and our employees feel comfortable in the space where they're working, so that they have every opportunity to handle the professional needs of the company as a whole. So I think that's a really cool way to tie it all together. It's not two ends of the spectrum, it's all part of the same concept.
(Jim): Correct.
(Skyler): Awesome. So, we had mentioned that there were three types of workspaces, or office spaces, that went into this project. What were those three types, and how were they different from each other?
(Jim): Well, you certainly had the executive offices. And then I'm going to say the director's offices or offices. You had the sales.
(Skyler): Sure.
(Jim): And then you had the teams. You had an accounting team and a sales team, and they each had different needs and wants, which made them different.
(Amanda): I thought it was very unique how they structure their different departments. They definitely highlight the executive offices. Those are by far the largest in the floor plan, but we do have those director offices, which are close to but not quite as large. And then some secondary offices that are still sufficient, they're just a little bit smaller. But it's also interesting, after that, you have the open offices, and there are two different open offices that are separated, but they still have their own unique feel to them. Overall, I found that interesting that they knew what they each needed, what they each wanted for those different spaces, and how their teams functioned. So it was trying to design for those different departments, which created a challenge, but a fun challenge.
(Skyler): Yeah, absolutely. And again, it comes back to that idea that a modern office is not a “one size fits all,” right? Each one of these departments has different needs and different requirements for them to do their job, or different ways that we can design their section in order to be more efficient. And so that's what we did. Right. We took each of those needs and adjusted based on that. So it's not just here's some fancy offices for the higher-ups and here's the sales floor or whatever you call it. It's what does each department actually need? And let's design based on those needs. So that is really cool.
(Jim): It is, and each of the departments had a say. We met with them to go through what they wanted and communicated directly with our furniture folks. They were able to articulate exactly what their needs were, and that's why they've got stuff that's tailored to them. We've got the ability for them to grow their spaces, but it was important that we actually had those discussions with the end users, and they would get exactly what they were looking for.
(Amanda): Yeah.
(Skyler): Fantastic.
(Jim): Their administration was like, “I want them to be as comfortable as they can be, so we're going to give them what they want.”
(Skyler): Yeah, and that was one of the key words Amanda mentioned, that was one of the highlight words that they wanted, “comfort.” They wanted people to be comfortable. So that's awesome.
(Amanda): I was going to add that I did find it really nice that the executive staff brought in those team members. Sometimes we don't have that with projects. We have clients that just create a couple of people who are in charge of, basically, that liaison aspect of helping us design what the rest of their team needs, versus here they picked out people from those different departments to say, “What does that department need?”
(Skyler): Right.
(Amanda): It wasn't just saying, well, we think they need this. Just design it.
(Skyler): Right, right. It's not just here, there are some representatives we picked out. It's here's a representative from each of the departments because they're most familiar with the needs of that department. So that's cool. That is awesome. That's another big takeaway too, and I know we've talked about it on previous episodes, don't just ask like the company owners or the school directors or whoever is the go-to person for the client. Go to the different departments, go to the different classrooms, talk to the teachers, talk to the employees, so on and so forth. Find out what it is that they feel like is missing and try to find ways to implement that into the design and things along those lines. Because they're the ones working there eight, nine, ten hours a day. We want them to feel like they're a part of the company. We want them to feel comfortable.
(Skyler): Now, we had mentioned that the IT department was a really key feature of this project. Obviously, you had mentioned that they have like server space that is running for the company as a whole, all their different locations, which is a big deal. What did we have to do as far as design goes to ensure that this IT department had what they needed? I know we talked about how we individualize the design for each of the departments. So, what did we do for them specifically? And what did we do to handle this very important server space that's being used by all the different locations in all the countries around the world?
(Jim): Well, needless to say, it's got specialized heating and cooling for the space. It's got the ability to be dehumidified and humidified, which is important in the place for which this location. The walls are concrete, so like I said, a true storm shelter. There are security measures as you come in that you would expect with it being a sensitive area. They had their individual desks and layout spaces designed for them, and furniture purchased that they wanted. The other ones were more of different types of carols. This one was very much more collaborative. They were kind of put together in little pods that made things interesting back there because they just work differently. They're working on computers and stuff that are individual, but they're still a team. And they do everything from fixing your computer and your mouse to what's happening with the entire network and everything else. So there's a lot to what they do.
(Jim): They weren't just stuck in the back of the house. They were important to be incorporated with everybody else. They had nice finishes like everybody else, marker boards, TVs, and monitors that they can show and write and do all the different collaborative types of things that you would do with any other business organization. They've got the ability to do that, which was very different because right now they're up on the second floor in this little mezzanine of this warehouse. So very different than what they're used to, and that was probably one of the bigger things, is that we were working through with the staff, and that leadership kept on wanting to reiterate is we’re not going back, you're not getting what you're used to.
(Skyler): Right.
(Jim): We want to be a step ahead. So we really had to work to bring the folks along because they would have been just happy with, “Well, give me a window and a little bit of light and a bathroom that's closer and I'm a happy camper.” And they said, “No, we want you to have more than that.”
(Skyler): Yeah, it's one of those things, like if you don't know that things are different in other places, that things are changing, and such like that, if you're not aware of it and you haven't seen it, then you don't know how to ask for it. You think, okay, well, a window would be nice, but other than that, we'll just do what we've always done, and it's why we take people on tours, oftentimes of other projects that we've done in the past, to showcase. These are the possibilities, these are things that we could do. Don’t stop at just what you think an office has looked like in the last 20 years. Think about what an office could be, and let's go with that as the design. That's very cool. And going back to that idea of employee comfort, we mentioned the conference room spaces, there are two of them, if I remember correctly. There's a kind of a smaller one, but it's a little bit more accessible. And there's a larger one that they can use for obviously larger conferences, but also if they had employee activities, or maybe a birthday celebration, or something like that. That would be a good space for that. We talked about the break rooms.
(Jim): There are a couple of different-sized conference rooms, yes. And the break room is also a training room, and it is much larger than your typical breakroom.
(Skyler): Right, and then they also had, if I remember correctly, a patio area which is pretty cool.
(Jim): Correct, because it's right across the parking lot from the plant. And they hold cookouts for their employees once a month or so.
(Skyler): Cool.
(Jim): So yes, it's a place for them to come across, grab a burger, hot dog, sit down, and enjoy their lunchtime in something a little different. The office staff gets to do the same thing. They actually have a fire pit out there if they have something towards an evening time. Because they've got staff who work extra shifts. So at night, it might be that they've got a TV and stuff. So they might watch TV. They could have some s'mores. They could still be doing a barbecue and that type of stuff with their employees. But they really wanted to speak to all their shifts, and a lot of times, corporations will just say, “Well, come in a little bit early. We're having a special celebration day.”
(Skyler): Sure.
(Jim): They aren't going to want to come in outside of their time. So, it was really a way to celebrate that fact. So yes, a breakroom and a larger breakroom. There are three refrigerators, there are lots of different types of seating, and it's just a really exciting space to be in.
(Skyler): Absolutely. Keeping it exciting, keeping it fun. That's how you make work feel less like work, and that's always very key. Amanda, you mentioned that they also integrated a mother's area, which is really important, again, for a modern office, especially. This is something that has been in need for a long time, this concept.
(Amanda): Yep. So I personally am a mother. When I started at CMBA, I was pregnant. So it kind of timed out really awkwardly that I had to eventually start nursing, in the office, and it created a challenge. They gave me a small conference room here to use. It's private, it's actually where we are currently. But I've slowly helped to evolve how we do that here in our office. I've pushed it with all of our corporate projects because I've realized it is a challenge for a lot of young mothers or just mothers in general, in an office environment. So anytime I can, I push for that we have one. And we were lucky enough that they were already thinking about this. So we put it on the floor plan and we pushed it through. Some things that we make sure we always have in the mother's rooms are a comfy chair, a sink, a fridge, and little amenities that are required. Because if you don't have it, where are you going to wash your parts, where are you going to store your milk? And making sure that it is private so that nobody feels insecure about it. Luckily, they were one of those clients who were fully on board with it.
(Skyler): That's awesome. And just like you said, it's so important. I think I'm trying to remember exactly the words that you used, but in the message with the overview that you had sent me, it was something along the lines of, “How do you expect to keep these young mothers who are working for your company? How do you expect to keep them if you're not offering them some of the needed amenities such as this?” Right? I think that's a great way to put it. We're talking about modern offices. This is exactly the kind of thing that we're talking about, not just doing it the same old way as we have been, and they'll figure it out or whatever. Taking that extra step to make all of your employees comfortable and making those spaces to ensure that they have what they need. I mean, this is somebody starting a family within your company. The last thing you want to do is make things inconvenient or frustrating for them, and then who's to say they don't start looking elsewhere because you are unwilling to accommodate them, with something as simple as just some privacy and some time to do what they need to do. And so that's awesome that you're pushing for that with all of the projects that we're doing, because that is very modern, and that is very necessary, for sure. One of the things that you had mentioned, also, Amanda, was within integrating the design into the facility, the branding, and things like that. There were Easter eggs that also got placed around some of the office. What kinds of things are we talking about here? What little hidden secrets?
(Amanda): Yeah. So their logo, if you want to check it out on their website, it's a diamond. It's kind of unique and different. But the fun thing was we found a lot of materials that had that shape, that logo imprinted on it. So tile was a simple thing. We have this unique tile that we found that we were able to place at backsplashes in the restrooms. The chandelier is a really fun one in that main entry area. We had micro interns last summer, and one of them threw this really fun chandelier in her design options for us, and we were really impressed. We were like, “Where did you find this!?” So we started dumpster diving on Google, and sure enough, we found it. And sure enough, our electrical engineer was like, “I think we can use this.” The chandelier is really fun, and I’m very excited and a little bit nervous for it. I'm always nervous. Let's be honest.
(Skyler): That's fair.
(Amanda): You want to do something fun and unique, but if you haven't done it before, well, let's cross our fingers. Let's hope it turns out perfectly.
(Skyler): Absolutely.
(Amanda): But the other thing that we had also is in the break room, we found Armstrong had a ceiling tile option where we could do their logo in the ceiling clouds. So something kind of different and unique. Some of the carpets have a little bit of funky shapes to them, so they kind of look like that.
(Skyler): Nice.
(Amanda): But just bringing out their team atmosphere about who they are within those little details, those materials, where we could.
(Jim): It's not overdone and gaudy. You know, some people will plaster it everywhere, and you're like, “Oh my goodness.” It really fits. Amanda did a wonderful job, making all these things work together with the inside and the outside of our building, and how it really felt. It harmonizes really well, and the logos are there, but they're not overpowering, which is really, really nice.
(Amanda): And their colors, too, I would add to that. We've learned in the past that sometimes branding changes, what do you do with that, and how does that affect your design? And so they wanted to bring out their colors, the orange and the navy blue. So we did, and it pops. But we didn't go too overboard, because as we've learned in the past, if branding changes, how do you change those colors?
(Skyler): Absolutely.
(Amanda): So we took that kind of minimally.
(Skyler): Yeah, that's fair. Got to play it somewhat safe for the potential for growth and change in the future. But that's really cool that we were able to find things that fit. But, like Jim suggested, in a subtle way, not over the top or anything like that, but in a cool, subtle, if you notice it, you notice it. And I think that's a lot of fun. And as somebody in marketing, obviously, branding is incredibly important, and being able to integrate that into the design is really cool. Amanda, you'd also mentioned, and I'm curious about this, that one of the conference rooms had kind of like a quote-unquote touch of Mad Men. What is that?
(Amanda): So my initial impression when I met this group was a lot of men. And, they do have female staff, so, do not get me wrong, but the men in particular, they just had this vibe that I wanted to bring across. And when we went through that visioning session, some of those pictures they liked. And so I was able to bring across a little bit of that Mad Men aspect. If you've ever seen the show, it's kind of interesting just to see that little bit of mid-century. But you think of what that “professional men's” atmosphere looks like? So we kind of have those darker wood tones. It's just that general feel. I didn't try to go too overboard with it because, again, you want it to be a timeless, professional, comfortable atmosphere that we were talking about. And, again, you don't want to just straight up steal something from shows. You want to make it unique to who they are.
(Skyler): Sure, sure. But it's cool to be able to take inspiration from anything, right? And be able to showcase it and say, “What do you guys think about this?” And they liked it. I think that's really cool. I think that's fun. I mean, obviously, it's something that you'll know. It's something that maybe some of the people who were involved in that part of the process will know. But in the future, people come in, they just say this is a cool spot, or this feels nice. They don't necessarily know this sort of secret behind-the-scenes of this was inspired to some extent by the Mad Men show, and some of the designs in there. So that's just kind of a fun Easter egg, you could say. Awesome. So with that being said, coming off the design, having things in construction right now on their way towards being finished, is there any particular element that you feel was the biggest takeaway from this project for you guys? It can obviously be different for both of you.
(Jim): For me, it was the fact that they did want to do something with a more modern, sleek tone to it. I mean, the rooms are generous, the space is generous. We've got clear story lighting into the open office space and lots of windows with glass fronts. So light is pouring in from everywhere. It's going to be a really comfortable space to be in, there are nice wood tones, and everything else. So it's not cold, right? It's got some warmth to it. And I just think they're going to be… I can't wait to see their faces when it's totally done, and they're moved in, and we go back and ask, “Well, how's it working for you?” I think they're going to love it.
(Skyler): Awesome. That's always kind of an exciting part of being able to get the facility going, and then you get to come back and hear how excited the clients are to be there. Amanda, what about you?
(Amanda): I would say my biggest takeaway from the project was just reimagining that entry for an office space. You're used to your typical receptionist desk, but in this case, they didn't need that; they didn't want that. And so, how can you start to revise how an office space works and functions? And what is that initial impression when you walk into a space?
(Skyler): Absolutely, it's exciting to be a part of the change
(Jim): Yeah, we went round and round on that one. Between Amanda, me, Matt, the architects, and the owners. We had a lot of options.
(Amanda): But it was a good session of trying to figure out what works best for them. And you get a lot of different opinions in it. It becomes a lot sometimes, but it's really interesting to dive into why we are designing and who we are designing it for.
(Skyler): Right, right, absolutely. Out of curiosity, were you both on the two different sides of that discussion?
(Jim): Of course, we were.
(Amanda): Jim and I always…
(Jim): And we end up with something perfect by the time it's done.
(Skyler): Yes, absolutely.
(Amanda): It’s part of the team atmosphere. It's what makes us come up with good design.
(Skyler): Right, right. If we all were thinking exactly the same way, then, again, offices would just be designed the same way forever, right? We need those differences in opinions, differences in ideas to help grow and create new things. So that's exciting. Awesome. Well, thank you both for taking time out of your day to talk to me about this project and kind of give some insight on what a modern office can look like, what a modern office can be, because I think a lot of people need to know that, right? A lot of people, again, have this idea that maybe they've never seen what could be, maybe they've never seen a modern office or know much about what kind of amenities or key features, or are focusing on employee needs and comfort. They just want to design it the way that it's always been. So I think it's really great that we're able to talk about this and to share what kind of things that we're doing in order to push the idea of new office, new features, things that are going to benefit the team that works at whatever office it is that we're working on. So thank you both, seriously, so much for being here.
(Jim): Thank you.
(Amanda): Thank you.
(Skyler): If you'd like to find out more about the Laying the Foundation podcast, you can head over to any podcast streaming platform, such as Spotify, iTunes, Google Podcasts, and others. You can also find out more about CMBA Architects through social media, such as Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and Instagram. Additionally, you can head over to the CMBA website at cmbaarchitects.com. If you're an architecture or design professional or an intern looking for an internship within those fields, please be sure to check out our we and click on the Careers tab to find out more about what opportunities we offer. This has been another episode of the Laying the Foundation podcast. We'll see you next time.