The Role of the Architect During Construction

This episode dives deep into the critical role of the architect during construction! Our host sits down with Dan Munch, Director of Construction Services at CMBA Architects, to discuss the architect's responsibilities throughout the building process. From ensuring quality and adhering to plans to navigating unforeseen challenges, Dan will shed light on this crucial collaboration between architect and builder. 

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Episode Transcript

Skyler: Welcome to another episode of laying the foundation.

Skyler: All right. Welcome back everybody to another episode of the laying the foundation podcast. Today, I Skylar, your typical hosts and joined with Dan Munch for the first time on the podcast. Uh, Dan is our director of construction services. I have it written real nice right here on the bottom. So I got it. Got it.

Skyler: Completely right, Dan, welcome to the show. Well,

Dan: thanks for having me.

Skyler: Absolutely. Well, I'm glad to have you here. Um, this is a side of the architecture process that I feel like I don't get to hear about a lot and I, I'm excited to learn and kind of understand how all this part of the project works. Um, for those of you that are listening, that might not have read the title of the episode today, we're going to be talking about.

Skyler: The role of the architect during the kind of construction phase.

Dan: So on our, on our side, we call that construction administration

Skyler: administration. Got it. Okay. So Dan, give me a, give me a quick, brief overview of kind of the aspects of this construction administration that we do. And, uh, maybe just a brief definition of what each of those kind of means.

Dan: Yeah. So we start with construction administration early in the project. Um, that starts clear back in before pre design working with our owner, working with our clients. Uh, we, we spend time with them, uh, Explaining what we're going to do during construction administration. It's kind of, it's kind of our process though, that they're well informed of what, what we do.

Dan: And a couple of things that we touched base on in construction administration are the bidding and negotiating phase. Uh, we also touched base on, um, Site observation, construction changes, pay application reviews, closeouts, and then kind of deliverables of each one of those throughout the different phases of construction administration.

Skyler: Okay, so we've got the design process and all the phases, and then we have the construction administration. And the phases within that.

Dan: Correct. So we have, we have certain phases within that, that we need to, that we need to make sure that we're well aware of. Um, probably the biggest thing that we need to remember throughout construction administration is we are the advocate for the owner.

Dan: So just like we started in the beginning, we've been the advocate for the owner from pre design during, uh, construction documents. I mean, design development all the way through CA, we're the advocate for the owner.

Skyler: Absolutely. They've told us what they need, what they're looking for. And we're there to put that into practice.

Skyler: Absolutely. Awesome. Awesome. So starting with, um, kind of the first part or first phase of the construction administration, um, you mentioned bidding. Um, what, what is involved with bidding?

Dan: So bidding usually comes down to our construction documents are complete. Our specifications are complete and we will either help engage A contractor or CM, uh, subcontractors, depending on what's happening, depending on what the type of project is in our three main sectors, then we'll reach out to contractors and say, Hey, this project's coming out to bid, and we're going to have a bid date on this date.

Dan: So contractors will pull together all of their information from our construction documents, addendums and so forth, and then they'll provide a bid to the, uh, To us and and the owner at the same time so that we review it usually during the bid opening The architect design team is there along with the owner They'll have a they may have anywhere between one to eleven bids.

Dan: It's just it just depends on each individual project Um, so then through that we kind of go through open up those bids Make sure they're conforming with everything that they're required to conform with. And then off we go to, to select a CM and just select or, or a general contractor to make sure that, uh, we're on the right path and on the right direction that the owner requires.

Dan: Awesome.

Skyler: Awesome. We got to figure out what those costs are going to be as far as the materials and the work.

Dan: That's a great question. So a lot of times we do put together a cost estimate at the beginning of the project. We'll put together a cost estimate throughout different phases of the, of the, um, project.

Dan: And here recently, we've really been trying to hone in those numbers before we go to bid. So we have a, so we have a little bit better number for the,

Skyler: Right. Right. Now, what about in situations where, I mean, prices are constantly changing. How do we kind of factor that in?

Dan: You try to as much as you possibly can.

Dan: Sure. After COVID, um, COVID kind of threw a wrench into everybody because of different delays, uh, different material delays, um, different delivery delays. Yes. Um, just actually making physical materials alone. So those prices escalated and we're starting to see a couple of them come back to where they were or get closer to where they were, um, especially on the delivery side, maybe not so much the.

Dan: The cost side, but yeah, that's a very difficult thing to do. Sometimes we'll hire a third party to, uh, put together a bid estimate for us. Oh,

Skyler: okay. Okay. Just to make sure that we can try to get as close as we possibly can. Awesome. What, I mean, are there any other challenges outside of that, that kind of come up within the bidding process?

Dan: Um, it's just making sure mostly that we're, that the, uh, companies or the CMGCs that are bidding the project, then they're fully aware of what's in the construction documents, what's in the addendums. Okay.

Skyler: Yeah. Getting it all into place, getting it all accurate as best as possible. Awesome. So then we go over to building the project.

Skyler: So. I guess this is kind of what most people would kind of think of when they think of, you know, construction and so on and so forth is, Oh, you got guys out there with the, with the wood and the nails and the hammer and whatever else, uh, putting the project together. But there's got to be more to it, especially from the architect's side.

Skyler: Um, they're the ones that designed this, this space. They're not necessarily the ones that are out there, you know, hammering the nails into wood, but, but what are they doing, I guess, during the building?

Dan: So during the, during the bidding of the building of your project, we kind of get into who's involved here, right?

Dan: At the very beginning, because we know we're going to have a CM involved, we know we're going to have a general contractor involved, and then they're going to have subcontractors below them. Sometimes they'll have what's called a third tier subcontractor, which is a subcontractor to a subcontractor. Wow.

Dan: So it can get a little bit, uh. Sometimes, um, but what we need to make sure is we need to, we need to make sure that we, uh, communicate to the owner who's involved. So we want to make sure we have a list of everybody that's involved that we can provide the owner so that they have any questions, comments, concerns, they can go to download the chain of command to whoever needs to be reached out to, or if there's any questions or anything like that.

Dan: So we have quite a bit of interest in building the project, right? We want to make sure that. We are visible on site. We're making sure that, uh, We are there to complete the construction documents in the physical form. Just so that we want to make sure that those, those I beams are in the right spots. We want to make sure that the forms are in the right spots.

Dan: We want to make sure that, you know, our finishes from tile to, um, ceiling tiles to four tiles to wall tile, right. But all those items are in place and in the correct spots. Um, they're within the tolerances. So we want, we want to make sure that on the design side and on the design team side. That the contractor or CM is following the construction documents as best they possibly can.

Skyler: Absolutely, because you can make obviously the designs and everything and hand it to somebody, but if they don't follow it, then there's going to be a problem. It can be tough. Correct. And I can imagine that it's also really useful for the owners to have somebody that can kind of Translate essentially the, the terminologies and the construction, uh, jargon and so on and so forth.

Dan: So we typically use a little bit different language than most of our clients typically do. Right. So we have to be able to translate from general contractor or subcontractor Back to the owner, and then we're kind of the go to, right? We're the point of contact for the owner. And we're the point of contact for the general contractor we're seeing them.

Dan: And we need to make sure that our communication skills are up to par in what we're communicating and the expectations that we're setting for the CM and for the owner are, are aligned. Um, I would say since CMBA, one of the main things that I've learned is it's kind of a three legged stool. Okay. So if the Contractor isn't happy.

Dan: Usually the design team and the owner's not happy, right? Owner's not happy. The design team and the contractor aren't happy. So we need to make sure that all three legs of that still work together to make sure that we're, everybody is happy and moving forward for the best possible product.

Skyler: Awesome.

Skyler: That's a great way to put it. I like that. I always like a nice, a nice visual metaphor there. So I've had the opportunity to go on a couple of these, or I guess mostly just be on hand during like a section of a project, maybe one of the other phases. We finished one. I'm getting pictures of that. They're working on another one.

Skyler: And it's kind of fun to watch. Like the architects will just like notice everything. They notice everything they see. Oh, that's a little bit out of place. I'll have to talk to the guy about that. Or let me double check that this was the right color that we were supposed to be using for this wall. Like it's kind of mind blowing to be honest.

Dan: It gets a little, it gets a little deep, you know, sometimes we talk about, um, let's just talk about rigid insulation, for instance. Sometimes rigid insulation can only be exposed to UV, uh, rays for so long, right? Can only be exposed for ultraviolet rays for so long. And we need to make sure that the owner's aware and the contractor aware that, Hey, this has to be covered up in a certain amount of time.

Dan: This has to be scheduled. Uh, correctly to make sure that all these items that need to be, that may be exposed to weather are encapsulated at the correct times. And so it gets, it gets, uh, outside of just making things, I'll say, look nice. Right. It gets a little bit more in depth than that. There's functionality.

Dan: Absolutely. We study, we study, uh, STC ratings, we study, uh, UL ratings. I mean, there's, there's quite a few different items that get involved into that before we even get to construction and we need to make sure that those items are followed, but once construction starts,

Skyler: absolutely. And obviously kind of going into the next part.

Skyler: point, site observation, those site visits, kind of like we talked about before to check on those things. How often do we do site visits usually, or does it kind of depend on the

Dan: project? Typically we'll outline that at the very beginning of the project. So we'll, in our contracts with the owner, we'll explain to the owner what's expected from us, what's expected from the general contractor, um, and then what's expected from the owner.

Dan: We'll outline those in the very beginning of our, of our contracts. That's where I said. Okay. See, it kind of starts all the way back in before pre design, correct? So we will spend time, we'll say, hey, we have, maybe we have, you know, 15 or 20 site visits throughout the, throughout the project. So we'll do a field observation for those, for those site visits.

Dan: And what we're typically looking for is, Is if there's any issues that arise, um, what corrections need to be made? If things are going well, things are on schedule things are behind we'll get down to Making sure that the weather is noted on the field report We'll we'll have items in the field report of what was discussed during the meetings.

Dan: We'll have photos of of progress as the construction, uh moves forward so we do quite a bit with The owner, the architect or the design team and the contractor doing the, during those site visits. And typically a site visit will happen during what's called an OAC meeting or owner architect contractor meeting.

Dan: Got it. So we'll, we'll do a full site, uh, site visit, walk the site. Uh, we'll talk the site typically with the owner and the general contractor. We'll answer questions of subcontractors or the general contractor. And then we just make notes as we go. So we can follow progress all the way through. Some of those items, you know, can be handled in the set observation report, just as a, Hey, friendly reminder.

Dan: We need to check on this in a month or, or, you know, Hey, we need to make sure that we, we correct this door hardware, that door hardware. Yeah,

Skyler: absolutely. And I'm sure there's the nice thing about it too, is obviously since we're picking the people that we're working with that are doing the construction and such like that, They've worked with us before, you know, they kind of notice these things.

Skyler: Ideally, we're picking people that are, you know, professional and that they've dealt with all kinds of construction projects and they'll catch things along the way, notify us, or we catch it, we notify them and they're able to fix it. Obviously, but. Yeah, absolutely So

Dan: as the as the advocate for the owner we need to make sure that we are out in front of those items that come Up so that we don't have any delays.

Dan: We don't have any Issues moving forward, but we're going to have some and everybody that's worked in construction is going to know between owner architect Design team i'll say contractor It's a big It's very, um, peaks and valleys. Sure. And so it's not very often that it's just a nice flat line that's a continuous pace, but it's very peaks and valleys and we're going to have some conflicts and we're going to have to make sure that our, our conflict resolution is in the correct form.

Dan: It's communicated well, and again, we're the advocate for the owner.

Skyler: Absolutely. So when it comes to things like changes or adjustments or things along those lines, I mean, what is the process for that?

Dan: So we have a, uh, quite a few forms, right? So we'll have what is called an ASI. Um, we'll also have, uh, it's an architectural supplementary, uh, instructions.

Dan: We will have what's called a field directive, um, FD. We'll also have an RFP, which is a request for proposal. So if there is, and then this is kind of the easiest way for us to explain this. If there's no cost and there needs to be a change, okay, then we'll issue an ASI. So let's say that we are changing, um, a ceiling height from let's say it's going from 10 foot to nine foot to maybe to accommodate some mechanical equipment or sprinkler heads or something like that.

Dan: We may have to make a minor adjustment, which doesn't change the design of the facility, but it's one of those things that come up in construction where we need to make a quick change And we, we just issue a quick change and say, Hey, you know what? We're just going to lower the ceiling from 10 foot to nine foot, just for an example, um, for an RFP, uh, those usually typically include costs.

Dan: And so in that situation, then let's say that during, um, during construction, the owner comes in and says, you know what? I would certainly like to add, you know, an outlet to this wall because we're going to have a new piece of furniture here.

Skyler: Yeah.

Dan: Okay, great. There's, there's added value to the project. And so the owner saying, Hey, we would absolutely love to have this outlet here.

Dan: We need it. And so the electrician, um, will, will, we will put together with the design team, what's called an RFP. It'll go out to the general contractor. He'll issue it to the electrical contractor. They'll put a number to it, issue it back to the general contractor and back to us. We will review it, uh, as a design team, we'll review those costs, and then we will pass that along to the owner for approval approved.

Dan: Then the contractor will install the outlet and off we go.

Skyler: Because of course, if it, you know, they're the ones paying for it. Correct. Absolutely. They have, they have,

Dan: they have full control in that situation. Correct? So a couple, another item that will come up is called an RFI. So a contractor may have a question on our documents as to what the finish is of the east wall in a lower level room.

Dan: Is this paint? Is it a, Is it a finished wall with, you know, two different color paints? Is it a tile wall? Is it, so maybe it's something on the construction documents that during QAQC that we may have just missed a note or something of that sort. And so maybe it's paint. So which paint color is it? Is it, you know, paint color one, two or three, maybe it's seven, eight or nine.

Dan: So we issue a, uh, the contract will issue an RFI to us or respond to the RFI and then provide him with documentation and go from there. A couple of other items that pop up during construction are what's called shop drawings. So, uh, we will, we will review shop drawings, the design team as a whole from, um, cast in place, concrete to termite control.

Dan: Oh, and anything that falls in between doors, door hardware, all the way through mechanical, electrical, plumbing systems, fire sprinkler, and so on. So from, for a couple of examples for us, we have interior exterior paint. We will have casework. Um, we'll have glazing. Um, so it kind of changes from, and we'll review all of these from beginning to end to make sure that they, those products that have been specified are being followed.

Dan: Um, and those items that are being submitted fit the design intent.

Skyler: Right. Cause you guys, I mean, you guys do a ton of research on those particular materials that are being used. Yeah. The regions that they're being used, obviously, wherever the project is being done, can it hold or use these products in an appropriate way?

Skyler: And how much is it going to help against, you know, anything from weather to temperature to. Everything in between. And like you said, termites even, you know, just everything in between. So yeah, it's obviously very particular that these, these specific things are being used.

Dan: Correct. And even with all the research that we do, contractors are typically out in front of us with different materials that are coming down from their suppliers.

Dan: Right. We have something new that works better here. Right. So, okay, great. And if that's the case and we can identify that early on, then, The contractor will issue a request, a request for substitution. Oh, okay. And so we can get that built right into the project early on before it's even bid. If we go back to the bidding phase and we certainly try to do as much research as we possibly can, uh, to make sure that we're, we're fully aware of those items that are coming from the field back towards us at the same time.

Dan: Absolutely.

Skyler: And I know there's kind of a, you know, on a, on a side note within that. We have those like, what do they call it? The classes that you guys kind of have a kind of class. Yeah. Yeah. And they'll have people that come in and pitch different products that can be used in different little

Dan: lunch and learn action.

Dan: Yep, absolutely. Yeah. So we, we attend quite a few of those throughout all five offices. So which is a great way for us to learn more and more about those products and

Skyler: find new opportunities or possible solutions to. Problems that you come across along the way. Attention architecture professionals. Are you looking for an employment opportunity that will provide you with a wonderful work culture and a competitive pay rate?

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Skyler: Awesome. So then we come to like the pay application process. What, who's getting paid, where, where's the payment going? How's this work?

Dan: So the pay application process, then, uh, the, the CM or general contractor will essentially issue a schedule of values, which tells us, um, most of the time they go by section, uh, by specification section.

Dan: They will tell us what each value of those sections are. Okay. And so then they will bill accordingly to how those sections get completed. And we will review those billing sections, and we will review those pay applications there once a month in our three main sectors or typically once a month, uh, we will review it for compliance and say, yes, we believe that, uh, This work is complete.

Dan: Um, we believe that these items are done and taken care of and they're being billed for appropriately. And if there are any questions, comments, or concerns, then we work directly with the contractor. Um, typically prior to even bringing that to the owner, we work directly with the contractor to resolve any of those issues, for example, a couple of things that come up.

Dan: Our store materials. So store materials are items that essentially we have discussed early on in the project. Um, after the, I should say early on in construction administration that the owner will say, yes, please get these materials ordered as soon as possible. The contractor will order those materials and they might sit.

Dan: In a warehouse, um, ready to go so that when the contractor is ready for them, then they're easily and readily available. So we'll ask that the contractor provide a proof of insurance and proof of documentation, photo documentation that these are in place. And then those will be, those will be billed as stored materials until they're, until they're installed.

Dan: And so we'll review those types of items, um, once we'll make sure that retainage is held correctly. Uh, we'll go through and make sure any change orders that need to be issued, uh, we'll make sure that any, any items that, that need to be coordinated with that pay application are complete.

Skyler: Okay.

Dan: We'll send it off.

Dan: We'll sign it and we'll send it off to the owner for review. And the contractor will sign on it as well and notarize it and off we go. So pay application is complete, everyone, um, we're getting, typically, uh, we will see if it's a, if it's in one of our three main sectors and we have a project that will last roughly 14 to 18 months, then about a month after the substantial completion date, Then we will see a final payment for that.

Skyler: Okay. Awesome. Now, when you were talking about the, you know, we sign, they sign owner signs, you had a smile on your face. That's ideal. Yeah.

Dan: Absolutely.

Skyler: What, what happens in situations where it's not quite ideal?

Dan: Um, we've had a couple of situations that I should say, I've had a couple of situations that have came up that we have just had to work through a couple of minor items.

Dan: Um, nothing, nothing over the top where we will make, we'll make notes on the pay application. Um, Hey, you know, the, this stored material isn't being built correctly or retainage isn't being held on, on this line item. It usually, in my experience, hasn't been. So far off that it's caused any heartache. Okay.

Dan: So there've been minor. Clerical items that used to get corrected and moved on.

Skyler: Oh, okay So usually it's something that can be adjusted and

Dan: correct. I'm not saying that hasn't happened in other offices. Yeah, of course Yes, no, it's it's

Skyler: a common situation that comes up every once in a while and you know things just happen It is what it is.

Skyler: But yeah, awesome. Okay, and then finally we're at the closeout Yeah, sounds like, uh, we're getting some closure on things.

Dan: This is, this is a fun time of the project. Okay. So we typically contractor, uh, CM is in, in subcontractors are in mad dash mode. Right. To get close to their, their, their wrapping things up.

Dan: And in, in move, it's moving very quickly. Interior finishes are going in. Uh, when I say interior finishes, we're talking carpet, we're talking paint, um, tile, those types of things that are the furniture, the owner's preparing to, to occupy the building, correct? Yeah. Occupy the facility. So closeout will happen.

Dan: We will create a punch list for before the closeout. So the design team will walk through the entire facility, exterior, interior, the roof, and we will review all aspects of construction. And so we create, what's a punch list, the contractor, the contractor, and the owner typically join us in those walkthroughs.

Dan: And for example, we'll go through with our lovely orange tape and we'll mark up walls, floors, or just different items. We'll create a punch list in an Excel file, and then we will provide it to the contractor And the contractor is responsible for assigning who's responsible for each item that's on the, on the punch list.

Dan: And then. That contractor will sign the plunge list once those items are complete. And then the general contractor will confirm that those items are complete, sign off on that, and then we will come back in and sign off that those items are complete as well. So it's kind of a, it can be a lengthy process.

Dan: Yeah. But at the same time, it's, it's exciting to see because the owner is excited to move in. Yeah. The contractor is excited to, to complete a nice project that's gone well. We're excited to see everybody excited because we're starting to see the fruits of our labor, you know, come into that full, full scope all the way around.

Dan: And we're happy to see, you know, the, the vision that started possibly, you know, two, three, four years in advance is now finally coming towards an end. Absolutely. With towards the end of that, what will happen as well is once we get to that punch list, we will create what is called a substantial completion form.

Skyler: Okay,

Dan: and so it is, uh, it's an AIA document and we will issue a substantial completion form for The general contractor and the owner and we'll put a date on it and attach the punch list with it Right. We'll make notes of items that maybe aren't aren't complete at the time, but aren't necessarily affecting Um, the owner to use a facility and it's an intended use.

Dan: Sure.

Skyler: Sure.

Dan: So typically the, um, the contractor has about 30 days to get those items complete.

Skyler: Okay.

Dan: And along with the punch list, the owner and the contractor will both sign that along with the design team. Once that is signed, then the warranties will come into effect on that date. So your one year building warranty will come into effect on that date.

Dan: Some depending on your different materials. We take glazing for example. Some of those, some of those glazing warranties will last up to 20 years. So that'll, they'll come into effect on, on that date. So yeah, it's kind of a, it's kind of a nice, uh, little closure to the, to the beginning of the formal end.

Skyler: Yes, absolutely. And as I understand, um, you know, that's not necessarily the end of everything for us. I'm told that, you know, the architects like to go back to those projects, talk to the owners, say, Hey, is everything working the way that we had Wanted it to, you know, was there anything that we can maybe find a way to change or, you know, what are people, what are people saying?

Skyler: What can we learn

Dan: from correct? So we have what's called a post occupancy walkthrough for an 11 month walkthrough. So excellent question about that 11 month mark, then we will walk through with the owner. And we will walk through with a general contractor. So we will make sure that there are all the warranties are in place.

Dan: We'll make sure that there's no, let's say, any roof leak issues or if maybe a wall has cracked or if there's maybe been some shift in some tile. Um, or maybe if there's a paint that is peeled, then those are all warranty repairs that the contractors are responsible for. So we'll mark those down and we'll communicate that with the owner, communicate that with the contractor and get those repaired before the full facility warranty has expired.

Dan: Right. So yeah, it's kind of a post occupancy, at the same time, um, typically we will also have a follow up, uh, with the owner. Um, or contractors say, Hey, is that what you had mentioned earlier? What can we do better? What have we learned? Where can we go from here? What's, what's our next goal? What are our future goals that we can do better?

Dan: How do we, how do we communicate that back to the very beginning of our project? Right. Say, Hey, we ran into the couple of these items during construction. How do we do that better on the right?

Skyler: Absolutely. Always improving, always growing, always getting better. And that's the key. It's really cool though, to, to kind of hear this from, from your end and everything about like the steps that we take.

Skyler: Um, I was just recently at the Chamberlain school and they're kind of putting their final touches on things. And like you said, with the closeout process, seeing those, you know, excited smiles on all the people. And we got to see that for sure. There were some teachers that were already moving into the school.

Skyler: They had their classroom set up and everybody was just ecstatic. It was awesome.

Dan: So I'm, I'm just going to assume that you've been involved in a little bit of this yourself. I know Chrissy and Katie both have. So at the end of the project, let's say the project is complete. Um, punch list is complete, everybody's happy and we're, we're ready to celebrate the project is complete and we're ready for the owner to move in and possibly have a nice open house or ribbon cutting.

Dan: Yeah. So we're able to help them with those types of events where we can give tours to different uh, local, local community members or any, uh, any facility, but it's still these maintenance, um, Yeah. Our manufacturing items that say, Hey, you know what? We've been a part of this process. Can we, you know, come in and take a look, or it can even be as far as future clients for the owner coming in and saying, we'd love to see your, your facility, so can we have a tour of it?

Dan: So we're more than happy to help with that. We help with professional photos. Oh, absolutely. Um, we help with, um, marketing materials for their open house. So those are all items that are, that. You know what I mean? Just a little bit more at the end for the, for the owner when we can help that out and really close that loop.

Skyler: Absolutely. It's a really call it like a symbiotic relationship with, with our marketing department and every project that we finish is the ability for us to obviously get pictures and promote what we help to design, but also obviously we're promoting it for our client, right? They're, they're getting the exposure.

Skyler: From our end and it's a really great relationship between us and them to get their, their word out and our word out and it's, it's awesome. We love doing the tours. We did some of those for Chamberlain this, this, uh, while we were up there for a convention just recently. So that was really exciting. And again, just being able to see the looks on people's faces.

Skyler: They're like, wow, this is really cool. I've never seen, you know, this before, or man, we should get this in our school. I know. Yeah. Uh, we also did a, uh, career fair with some students for some, some, uh, I think there were high school students. And it was really funny when, uh, I was there at the booth and we were handing out like those little booklets that we do with all the pictures of the different school projects and stuff.

Skyler: And some of the kids came in, they grabbed one of the pamphlets, they ran off and found their superintendent who was there. traveled in the bus with them and they're like, we want our school to look like this. That's

Dan: spectacular. And

Skyler: that was really exciting for us. And I know I'm going to say it here in the close out, uh, once I add that to the end, but obviously if you're somebody that's interested in finding out a little bit about what CMBA does and has done, we have a whole wealth of the projects that we worked on, uh, on our website at cmbaarchitects.

Skyler: com. So definitely be sure to check that out. But, uh, yeah. In the meantime, Dan, thank you so much.

Dan: Oh, thank you. I'm glad we got, we're able to do this. I know it's been hit and miss with our schedules and I know we just, we just scratched the surface here. I think if we, uh, if we drilled in here just a little bit, we could probably do a week long session for about a year.

Dan: Before we get to the end of CAs. Well, I'll write that down and make sure to reach out to you again to talk about the next aspect because I love doing

Skyler: podcast episodes with everybody and learning the amazing, like just the expertise that you guys come with. I mean, you were rattling off acronyms faster than I could, I could.

Skyler: Um, but seriously, Dan, thank you again for being on the show and telling us a lot about that construction administration process and, uh, and kind of all the facets and phases as, as involved with that. So, absolutely. If you'd like to find out more about the laying the foundation podcast, you can head over to any podcast streaming platform, such as Spotify, iTunes, Google podcasts, and others.

Skyler: You can also find out more about CMBA architects through social media, such as Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and Instagram. Additionally, you can head over to the CBA website@cbaarchitects.com. If you're an architecture or design professional or an intern looking for an internship within those fields, please be sure to check out our website and click on the careers tab to find out more about what opportunities we offer.

Skyler: This has been another episode of The Laying The Foundation Podcast. We'll see you next time.